Delegates/Masternodes broken and unfair???

  • Hello,

    Someone made a reddit post here with some questions and I am most concerned about number 3.

    "Delegate/Masternodes at this time the system is pretty broken because nobody has a real motivation to vote for any masternode, the lack of interest comes from the lack of benefit, think it for a moment why somebody should spend a fraction of his coins when there's nothing in exchange and even worse the guys in the top rich list are those that are running the masternodes. Of the 101 masternodes I know just a handful number of them that are doing something to help the community, the rest of them I don't even know their names. Claiming that Asch team want decentralization is just an oxymoron when the opportunity to have a masternode is just for the persons with a big chunk of money and you don't even need to do something for the coin, you just use the vote system to your benefit. The lack of information that explain to the investors that they are not going to receive any coins as any other DPOS is other of the problems."

    I am looking for answers.

    I do not care to vote because all rewards go to delegates. share with me as voter, and i am active community member. otherwise i dont care and this is another coin i am not going to care about.
    i don't see a good answer to #3. The answer stated is that the delegates in the top 101 worked hard to get there, earlier in the community. so it is very hard to get there now as a newer member? almost impossible? i don't see how they will change because its like politics - the older candidates are in and its easy to stay in the system and no one has incentive to vote. this also looks like corruption to me and all the answers i hear are typical "politics" answers which are all BS and no substance. the delegate system is there to secure the network? OK.. so are 100x other systems like POS and hybrid POW+POS and mining w/asics+GPU+CPU But you aren't doing any of that.

    also i dont see it being fair because they get lifetime rewards and get paid so much just for helping earlier, and so theres no real incentive for me to help now. and those people now sit there doing nothing and get paid while me i don't get much unless i share articles or become a marketer. which i don't want to do. and there are no bug bounties or opportunities for me to be useful with my skills as a software engineer.

    basically you're trying very hard to appeal to westerners, but there is no benefit for us to participate in your system. we cannot become delegates as its very hard to change the system from old delegates. it sounds to me actually like you only want our money, and my money is my limited involvement in the project. sounds more like you want to market to westerners for our cash pump but keep the incentives in china i.e. don't care if we get any of the other incentives of the system.

  • @sikas I'm waiting on an answer from this. If anyone ever hears and finds out, please share here. Right now it seems the asch mods/admins/delegates don't respond here. Thats a red flag for me and I am exiting my investments in Asch until a future date.

    Thank you.

  • Agree with above comments , info on delegates and what/who they are and how they're contributing to the ASCH project would be needed before i vote

    The DPOS system/reddit ARK uses is very good at this

    Some of the delegates also share rewards with voters ...obv i think thats a good idea ;)

  • @corpuscrypto great. looking to see some changes like that implemented as well.

    i'm happy to see the project continually expand, generate good work, and have a positive community. if i can contribute, i'd like to be a part of that community.

    i think we both agree- we both feel uncomfortable knowing there are people above generating xas without knowing what they do.

  • @littlewhale @feng First of all, thank you for making ASCH better. I don't have the time nor the skills to do that background jobs you mention, and if ASCH is growing, is due to its community, and actually I'm trying to do my part in that. But I still believe, from a perspective of a new user, who just got their first XAS and wants to vote for someone, that we should facilitate the task of knowing better what are the delegates doing. Sure, people could visit the forums, use google translate (if the user doesn't know chinese, like me) to check the chinese part of it (wich cointains the majority of the information), or maybe check the github. But, shouldn't be useful that in the web wallet there were actually information about the delegates? Let them write something about theirselves, and let me check that while browsing the delegate list. I believe that would improve transparency, as @mannanj wants. That way, at least a piece of information will be added, and I don't believe that would hurt anybody, on the contrary, it will help making ASCH a better community.

    However @mannanj , it is a HUGE step to say that maybe they're corrupted, just because we're lacking some info. Using kind of words isn't very wise. I believe the proof of there is actually a good work going on is that the community is getting bigger, there are people working on DApps using ASCH's tech, and many people are volunteers here. That is a very good sign of that something good is happening here.

  • @feng said in Delegates/Masternodes broken and unfair???:

    The other is that you said your software skill can't do help to the community, in fact, we need people like you to do some test, on the other hands

    Where can I go and find the testing work to do? What do you need me to test? The wallet?

    I didn't misunderstand, but I did come off as whiney and entitled, and for that I apologize. The point I was trying to make, is that it shouldn't be so that early adopters get lifetime rewards. Usually in a real life company or organization, they get limited stock, and that's it. That stock doesn't make more stock out of thin air, or like POS here, generate more and more ASCH. Where that seems unfair, is that newer people have no incentive to join because it's very hard for them to feel like they are being compensated fairly.

    I am not asking to be chosen or feel like I should be entitled to anything from the ASCH community. I am only asking questions, to get answers and start healthy discussion, do you understand feng?

    I don't want to become a delegate. I want to see TRANSPARENCY in the delegates we have. I want to see how and when and why they became the delegates. Like in our political system in the US, when we have congress men and women we see how much of the vote they won, go to their website to see what ideas and philosophy they stand for, etc. How do I see what the delegates are doing? Where is the link to them in real life? All they look like to me is a USERNAME on paper making $$$. BUT GIVE ME THE INFO ON HOW THEY GOT THERE AND HOW THEY EARNED IT. SO i can see what the community is contributing, and how it rewards them.. so that can motivate me and newer community members and we can see if we put in that type of work, it'll pay off with generating xx ASCH/month and being a delegate. If this transparency is NOT added, I can tell you this project is going to not appeal to new users very much. Because it'll feel corrupt.

    Do you understand my point now?

    Are there features in roadmap or in wallet to easily associate delegates with who and what they are doing to become delegate? If not, then I will assume that all of them are only there because of corruption and crookedness (friends voting for friends, fake accounts, fake wallets voting for them like delegates) because that is all I've come to see from real life politics which closely model your delegate system.

  • administrators

    @mannanj Glad to see you guys typing so many words here, but I think you must misunderstand something, one is that you think it's unfair for people who get into earlier get huge rewards, i would like to say maybe it's unfair, but it's very normal in real life, any company or organization, even a country will give preferential treatment to the early member, they take a risk and deserve the rewards. The other is that you said your software skill can't do help to the community, in fact, we need people like you to do some test, on the other hands, if your skill really mean nothing to the community, what will you do? just cry on the forum to ask for a delegate so you can get paid? Community choose the people who can help the community, it's very normal that you are not choosen

    Besides, Asch never focus on your money, if you don't like Asch, just vote with your feet. There is no extra help for anyone, community will treat each people equally, no matter he is Chinese or westerners

  • @corpuscrypto @mannanj Thanks for your concerns on the delegate system. Many delegates you rarely heard or dont know what they have contributed, because many of them are donging background jobs, coding, design, server maintainance and etc. If you watch carefully, you will find that delegate list is always updating. Take me for example, i have been a delegate only 2 months together with aschwifi, xishizhenbao, yangkaifeng, ping and etc. bb25 and sandylast just became delegates last week. Most of us are not big holders, in fact i have only 40,000 XAS. The delegate list is always changing. I suggest you doing a more detailed survey, not only through what you heard or guess.

  • @corpuscrypto Thanks for encouraging me to do so. I just want to have the correct information out there. Seeking the truth. This project has too much potential to have a lack of clear information out there.

    I think that's a great idea. If you could click each delegate in the wallet, to see detailed information like:

    • Date they became a delegate
    • Votes they get
    • Information on the voters
    • Their contributions
    • Sort of like a "dating profile"

    I feel like that would add transparency to the system and make it seem more fair.

  • I'm glad you posted this like I suggested on Reddit, a healthy debate contributes to community.

    Personally I believe it would help if the online wallet showed more information about delegates: what are they doing, their proposals, their work , etc.

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